Actually David, I think our similarities (and they are numerous) are what bring us togehter and our differences is what keeps us here. You are so right that if we were all the same, it would bore me to the point of insanity (although I have been accused of this already). My hope when coming here, and why I have stayed, is exactly what you brought up: a safe community to admit what I don't know and an amazing place to learn. With few exceptions, that attitude has been the norm here and I would hope becomes the gold standard for all other boards. This said, I found nothing arrogant or high handed about your post in question. We need more folks who post well thought out topics that challenge us all. No pain, no gain. Al, you too have been a great addition here, but I admit to being put off by the hostility of your rebuttal. I would hope you wold check David's veracity, if you question it, before going into pit bull mode. BTW curious why have you left CFI? In the grand scheme of things, I believe they have accomplished far more good than bad. I encourage any efforts anyone makes to increase the worth and pride in the installation end of our biz. Egos notwithstanding (not referring to you AL!) , CFI has done this.