Mannington Adura Max

Discussion in 'Vinyl Flooring Q&A' started by Bridgette, Apr 11, 2017.

  1. Bridgette

    Bridgette New Member

    Hi all!!!

    Because of flooding, I am rebuilding my house. We have pretty much decided on Vinyl Plank and I have chosen the Mannington Adura Max ( haven't ordered it yet).

    I have been searching reviews on this flooring and seem to find them from one extreme to the other. I am in Louisiana and our climate is one of heavy humidity. I will be installing this directly on concrete and we are doing it ourselves. It is obvious that the moisture barrier under my slab has tears as I can lay a piece of plastic down ( say for painting) and when done, there is condensation under the plastic. After reading through these forums, my thought to put a antimicrobial pad is not going to work because the padding could/ will cause issue with the seams of the flooring.

    I have spoken to the manufacturer and this floor requires no underlayment. I obviously need something because the floor would not be warrantied should mold and such be an issue later, nor do I want the issue .

    Several questions. 1. Anyone familiar with this particular flooring and past problems? 2. What should I use as an underlayment.

    Apologies if this is answer is somewhere else and I haven't found it.

    Thanks in Advance
     
  2. Commercial Floor Rep

    Commercial Floor Rep I Support TFP Published

    Welcome to TFP!

    First, full disclosure, I work for a Mannington wholesale distributor. We sell the products to the dealers who consumers such as yourself would be buying from. I wouldn't even attempt to do a "sales job" on you regarding the product because that's not what this site is about. You're no where near my sales area so it doesn't effect me in the least whether you purchase the product or a competitive product.

    What I would like to share is that being in my position gives me the opportunity to see products sold in a fairly sizable area and whether or not they have problems. Adura Max is a top selling product in the industry and has been since it was launched. It's literally sold so fast that at times we've had supply chain problems keeping it in stock. In other words we've sold a ton of the product. In all of the product we've sold to all the different dealers in our territory (3 states), we have had 1 claim. It was a legitimate issue with the finish. It came out of the first "batch" of product we received when the product first launched and Mannington took care of the claim.

    In the 20+ years I've been here I believe it has been the least problematic product we've launched with Mannington.

    Now, I'm much more concerned about your slab issue. The product itself is moisture proof, but if you read the installation instructions for this product or for any of the competitive products they still require that you adhere to the concrete moisture emission standards for other types of resilient floors. It isn't so much a problem of the water itself coming into contact with the product as it's waterproof, it's the other things that come up through the slab with the moisture - such as the alkalinity salts - that can effect the product itself or cause other issues such as mold and mildew under the floor where you can't clean it. It becomes more a safety issue for you and your family.

    There are a couple of approaches you could take.

    1). You can simply apply a minimum 6mil poly plastic sheeting (Visqueen) over the slab prior to installing. You'd want to overlap the sheets a good 6" and tape them with a thin clear "packing" tape.
    ***STRONG WORDS OF CAUTION WITH THIS APPROACH***
    -You will not stop the moisture from coming through the slab with this approach. It's just not going to reach the flooring where it could damage it. BUT.....that moisture can still cause mold and mildew (and the associated odor) to grow underneath the plastic. This could obviously be a health concern for you and your family.

    2). Install a moisture control system. There are a ton of options in moisture control systems available. HOWEVER, since you've stated that you have a compromised vapor retarder under the slab, it's almost pointless to do moisture testing. Given your geography you can pretty much assume you're at 100% Rh (Relative Humidity) in the slab. This means your options become very limited and unfortunately fairly pricey. The only real solution would be to do a full blown epoxy system such as the ones offered by Koester, Mapei, or Ardex. These are fairly laborious (they require shotblasting the floor to prep it for the epoxy) and messy so it's going to be a process to do it if you plan on living in the house while you're performing the work. Now for a bit of good news - if you choose to go this route, you won't have to do this again the next time you replace the flooring. You're essentially capping the slab and starting anew.

    At any rate, I hope this helps and wish you luck in whatever you choose to do!
     
  3. Bridgette

    Bridgette New Member

    Thank you for your response. You have put my mind at ease about the flooring itself. Shame that I cannot buy it at a local retailer for the same price I can online. I actually put my hands on it here in store and promptly put it back because of pricing. There was no comparison to the other vinyl planks I laid it next to. :)

    We have actually already had to get after the floor with a diamond blade where previous adhesive was years ago. I had laid ceramic 14 years ago and the ceramic was starting to loosen because of the adhesive. I WAS going to go back with ceramic plank. Obviously the advise given 14 years ago about adding add mix to the motar, and add mix on the floor wasn't permanent. The motar stuck to the adhesive more than the concrete.

    I considered your second option, but sealing the concrete would force the moisture where I cannot seal IE: in the wall area of the floor. NOT GOOD.

    Do they make a visqueen type material that is antimicrobial? Is there such a beast?

    Thanks
     
  4. Mike Antonetti

    Mike Antonetti I Support TFP Senior Member

    If done properly, porcelain will bond to slab and thinset, nearly forever. For the price, it's your only option.

    Looking out at a canal to Kings Bay on Monday while ripping up ceramic, the waterline about 2 ft lower than slab height and having to go around the block to turn around and contractors working on homes that recently may have flooded, I think there are too many issues with flooring other than porcelain.

    They did have a nice Adura sample, (very distinct) and a wide 10" vinyl plank, terra cotta box color brand.
     
  5. Commercial Floor Rep

    Commercial Floor Rep I Support TFP Published

    Interestingly moisture vapor will not travel sideways through a slab and force the moisture into the wall. It has to do with Boyle's gas laws and pressure gradients as well as the way the concrete "capillary matrix" forms when it cures. However, the walls are built on top of the slab so if the barrier is compromised under the wall that moisture is already emitting from under the framing plate into that wall. This is one of the reasons when they hang drywall they leave it up off the concrete a bit because it will wick moisture from the concrete when it's curing which can lead to mold. It also helps keep the drywall from cracking when the building settles.
     
  6. Commercial Floor Rep

    Commercial Floor Rep I Support TFP Published

    Sorry, just saw Mike's post as well. Porcelain would be another solution. Today's modified mortars can handle moisture passing through them. The only downside is you could possibly see efflorescence (white salt crystals) appear on the grout joints over time. These can be difficult to clean off.
     
  7. Mike Antonetti

    Mike Antonetti I Support TFP Senior Member

    There are also mortars and grouts that can "nearly" eliminate efflorescence. Good point and should be addressed when determining products to use.
     
  8. Bridgette

    Bridgette New Member

    Did not know that. Since I have had to look at 2x4s for 5 months and have seen every inch of the inside walls of my house, that hasn't been an issue in 40 years :) Never had an issue with " efflorescence" in my previous ceramic flooring grout. THANK GOD! Yes, Ceramic or Porcelain was my first option because of durability. I LOVE the look of wood floors but wood is not as durable. Hence, why I am now looking at the vinyl. Not to mention, I can put this vinyl down for half the price of porcelain( I am not going the cheap route on any of it)

    Since my house was filled with muck, I can't tell you what was under one of the rooms with laminate for 5 years and I never smelled anything that smelled mildewed, Only that we obviously did a good job putting it down because we had to take it up, it wasn't floating away like neighbors. thanks all for your timely responses.
     
  9. Bridgette

    Bridgette New Member

    Commercial Floor Rep: Your thoughts using this under this floor?
     

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  10. Commercial Floor Rep

    Commercial Floor Rep I Support TFP Published

    Hi Bridgette,

    It's funny you chose that particular product as I'm also a vendor for Roberts. That product is not made to go under LVT. It's made for laminate and engineered hardwood. The other issue is that you already have a built in cushion on the underside of the AduraMax. This would allow too much give in the floor and could cause damage to the locking system leading to planks coming unlocked or gapping.

    If you wanted additional protection against moisture coming from the slab there is a product called VersaShield MBX which covers up to a 99% Rh. It's kind of expensive compared to just using visqueen but it's something that you can use under an LVT such as AduraMax.
     
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