Hardwood floor making owner sick?

Discussion in 'Article Discussion Forum' started by Jon Scanlan, May 3, 2015.

  1. Jon Scanlan

    Jon Scanlan That Kiwi Charter Member I Support TFP Senior Member

    This was on our Fair go programme the other nite
    Notice how the home owner speaks with an accent you should recognise :)

    Floored - TV News Video | TVNZ
     
  2. Mike Antonetti

    Mike Antonetti I Support TFP Senior Member

    Deceptive cowards. Why don't they just say it contains built in pesticides and no need for additional spray.

    Sad, 26 g's is there not enough to make a legitimate profit from?
     
  3. Incognito

    Incognito No more Mr. Nice Guy! I Support TFP Senior Member

  4. Mike Antonetti

    Mike Antonetti I Support TFP Senior Member

    What's the real deal with this issue? Is there not enough adhesive on this planet? Does competition cause criminality at the cost of health? Are we just seeing what the human body will endure? Is our lifestyle unrealistic/unaffordable?

    Can I get/ will someone spill the truth? Or "YOU CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH!
     
  5. kylenelson

    kylenelson You'll find me on the floor I Support TFP Senior Member

    People want cheap. Cheap drives shortcuts. Shortcuts equal potential hazards, especially when dealing with chemicals.
     
  6. Incognito

    Incognito No more Mr. Nice Guy! I Support TFP Senior Member

    Well, you probably need a pretty high degree of scientific education to understand what chemicals and materials are inherently and unquestionably unsafe for humans. THEN you still have to establish and measure specific LEVELS of those substances that would be tolerable........right? Nothing simple whatsoever about this question Mike. So there's government and industry that try to regulate those toxic agents either through laws or voluntary quality standards.

    There will always be cheaters and FAILURES to comply for reasons of both greed and incompetence. There are as many explanations for failure and greed as there are instances of cheating and violations of standards.

    To prove criminal intent you pretty much have to demonstrate in court and convince a judge or jury that the corporate executives had INTENT to endanger the health, deceive or defraud the customers.

    Being that we are talking about variances in measurements of one tenth of one part per million in air quality or........WHATEVER I think the scientific evidence goes right over the head of any jury.

    These cases get settled out of court-----legally. Then there's the court of public opinion. Americans tend to believe whatever their TV (internet, radio, newspaper) tell them to believe. So that's a whole 'nuther ballgame.

    it's gonna get tougher to sell laminate

    maybe that's the whole point
     
  7. Incognito

    Incognito No more Mr. Nice Guy! I Support TFP Senior Member

    There's the 25 words or less explanation. Perfect.
     
  8. kylenelson

    kylenelson You'll find me on the floor I Support TFP Senior Member

    Maybe this will start driving the market away from disposable floors. Wood, stone, etc. will not be going away any time soon as long as there are crappy products out there selling their good points for them.
     
  9. Mike Antonetti

    Mike Antonetti I Support TFP Senior Member

    I use to see it as a Chinese issue, not so, I believe it is American corporations that knowingly do this. The one video on 60 minutes shows no intention of Chinese manufacturer to deceive, the workers were on the up and up.
     
  10. Jon Scanlan

    Jon Scanlan That Kiwi Charter Member I Support TFP Senior Member

    And no one mentioned that the owner had a different funny accent to us :)
     
  11. kylenelson

    kylenelson You'll find me on the floor I Support TFP Senior Member

    I prefer the NZ accent over the AUS accent...that's just me though. Probably 'cause I've known more kiwis over the years. There are lots of americans that have funnier accents than your guy's.
     
  12. I've heard this before of Torlys products being produced in China. Some people have stopped carrying the Torlys brand because of some of this less-than-transparent information about country of origin.

    If this home owner has a legit concern, he can have it tested. Send it home to a family member in the USA and have them ship it off to a testing facility if NZ doesn't have a lab that can do it (if NZ doesn't have it, Aus should).

    Another fun fact about Torlys...they like to use mould inhibitors AKA Microban in their flooring. THese products are understood to be hormone inhibitors and the EU doesn't like them very much...they allow some but not very much. The Torlys floors like PLENTY of additives...they 'sound' great...but in the end they are all chemicals and each chemical can have health effects. That's why we won't sell Torlys cork.
     
  13. Jon Scanlan

    Jon Scanlan That Kiwi Charter Member I Support TFP Senior Member

    He did do that and send it to the States about the 6 minute mark
     
  14. I guess I didn't watch the flick all the way to the end. I guess we have to wait for results?
     
  15. AS1_NZ

    AS1_NZ Member

    I am the one in the video. I have more information I would like to provide other than what Fair Go has shown. I will do that over the next couple of days. What has been publicly aired is probably only 20% of the story.

    This floor was an expensive floor and more expensive than typical engineered hardwood floor boards which have a formaldehyde emission significantly below the established E1 and CARB formaldehyde regulations.

    So the use of a high formaldehyde MDF core and claiming it is formaldehyde free, was done to the benefit of Torlys and their profit margins. Not the customer.

    Torlys claimed compliance with CARB (Phase 2) and E1 and none of that was true. When the core board was tested, it was twice over E1 more than two years later! Formaldehyde emissions decay overtime. Which means almost certainly it was even higher when the boards were manufactured.

    The purpose of all of the testing was to be used in court and to back up the airing of this story publicly. The toxic effects from the Torlys floorboards were extremely obvious and quite serious within 10 days of living in the house.

    These floorboards were particularly dangerous because they contained a cork layer at the bottom which I believe absorbed various volatile organic compounds while they were in the box for a year and those compounds were being significantly emitted from the cork after the boards were laid on the floor.

    The California Department of Public-health 01350 test which Torlys has done on the floorboards, is not able to determine the true formaldehyde emissions from these floorboards because of edge and bottom sealing during the test. Essentially that test is nothing more than a sham if it is used to claim a floorboard of this particular type which has a high formaldehyde MDF core and cork bottom, as being safe.

    There is no doubt about the harm those Torlys floorboards had upon myself and two of the builders, most especially one of them. The Fair Go story was meant to be objective and as balanced as possible to avoid the possibility of any defamation claim.

    This is one of the video showing the toxic effects:
    [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elEiZfFZvXw"]China Floor Toxic and Long-term Health Effects. Formaldehyde. Sep-Nov 2014 - YouTube[/ame]
     
  16. AS1_NZ

    AS1_NZ Member

    I am the one in the Fair Go story. I made a post here and it got deleted very quickly.

    I guess simply stating the truth about floorboard toxicity, gets suppressed on this forum?

    If anyone has any questions, please contact me through the messaging system of this forum.
     
  17. Mike Antonetti

    Mike Antonetti I Support TFP Senior Member

    It's a conspiracy I say!

    I don't remember all the details but in my book, your legit.

    I wouldn't say Jim is biased toward anyone, but if you try to sway the truth or some other matter which we don't know about, he has the power to do so, sorta like Putin.
     
  18. Bud Cline

    Bud Cline Tile Expert Charter Member Senior Member Published

    I'm thinking you are mistakin' but I'll let ADMIN answer to this. The exact verbiage content of your allegedly deleted post may have had something to do with its demise, if in fact it was deleted.

    ADMIN? Do you care to answer to the charges?
     
  19. Elmer Fudd

    Elmer Fudd Administwative Asst. Charter Member I Support TFP Senior Member

    Do you have anything to back this up?

    All I hear is YOU saying (20 times over) that it is the fault of the flooring!

    Have you been to a doctor? Has it been checked by an Indoor Air Quality Professional?
    Has the laminate been tested by an independent lab? What are your qualifications to determine that it is the fault of the flooring?
    I am NOT making judgement, just asking questions, so I could possibly make a judgment in the future.

    What you presently have is your own generalized accusation against the manufacturer, unless you have facts and testing behind you you are simply spitting in the wind.
     
  20. Elmer Fudd

    Elmer Fudd Administwative Asst. Charter Member I Support TFP Senior Member

    It did not get deleted, because you posted a video it went into review.
     
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