Glue won't dry

Discussion in 'Vinyl Flooring Q&A' started by Dale S, May 9, 2014.

  1. Dale S

    Dale S New Member

    5 days ago i put down Kardean 18 X 24 Luxury vinyl Tile (SP 215 Ferna).
    I used Roberts 2310 LVT Adhesive. I installed it over linoleum flooring. It has not set up at all. I pulled several tiles today and the adhesive was just wet as it was when it came out of the container. It keeps seeping up between the tiles and I'm thinking I'm going to have to pull it all up and do a large clean up. I was wondering if I could pull tiles and let the adhesive cure and then reinstall. Its supposed to be a tacky adhesive and not harden. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
    Dale S
     
  2. epoxyman

    epoxyman Pro Member

    Just a guess on my part but maybe the linoleum flooring you went over is keeping it from drying.

    There will be other guys with more info around soon mine is just a guess at this time.

    Hope you can get it fixed :)
     
  3. Bud Cline

    Bud Cline Tile Expert Charter Member Senior Member Published

    I would say you are correct.

    The instructions talk about concrete substrates and wood substrates and suitable patches but nowhere that I can find does it say anything about being suitable for use over linoleum or anything of the kind.:eek:

    I guess I don't understand why the tiles were placed in a wet/fluid adhesive to begin with. That usually isn't the way it's done.

    Unfortunately I'm thinking this is going to be a total do-over. That's gonna be a helluva mess.:(

    PS: I just happened to think...Most of those adhesive products (of today) are water soluble early in their exposure to the environment. It is conceivable that if you were to remove the tile soonly you could also wash them with water without too much effort. This would make things a whole lot easier.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2014
  4. If your vinyl has texture it's eating up adhesive, putting down more that is required.
    Directions as Bud and epoxy guy! Say is for substrates that will absorb the "vehicle"( water) in the adhesive. It is trapped , nowhere to dry .
    Plus we don't know what trowel you used. You probably should have emboss leveled the sheet vinyl at a minimum or removed if it were not asbestos.
    This adhesive wants 100% transfer so it is installed wet.
    You may be able to pull a few rows, let it 80% then set in, repeat,
    I have a bucket on my shelf.
     

    Attached Files:

  5. Jim McClain

    Jim McClain TFP Owner/Founder Administrator

    Did you see this part in the instructions that come with the adhesive:
    I think that means this adhesive was designed to be spread on concrete, APA rated plywood or terrazzo, not old linoleum. Karndean also makes their own adhesive, which can be used over old lino and other existing floor coverings. You might have been able to use the 2310, if you had abraded the lino and skim-coated it with a portland cement floor patching compound, like Henry's Feather Finish or Ardex Feather Finish with the appropriate additive.

    Jim
     
  6. Incognito

    Incognito No more Mr. Nice Guy! I Support TFP Senior Member

    linoleum------REAL lino is somewhat porous.

    My bet is you laid over VINYL.

    So impermeable membrane on the bottom
    Impermeable membrane on top.

    It's a sheet of plastic on the bottom and big plastic squares on top. How could it possible dry AFTER you lay the tile?
     
  7. RobertT

    RobertT Pro Member

    I assume "linoleum" is being used as a generic term for vinyl. 2310 is a pressure sensitive adhesive. The adhesive should be allowed to set up until dry to the touch and tacky. If you install into wet adhesive over existing vinyl it can't dry down thru the old floor and can't dry up thru the new floor.
     
  8. Dale S

    Dale S New Member

    Thanks to all of you, the writing is on the wall, Im pulling it up tomorrow, licking my wounds and then consulting you guys before my next attempt. This is a wonderful forum, thanks for responding so quickly.

    Do you think I could pull the tile and let the adhesive get tacky and then reinstall?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 9, 2014
  9. Bud Cline

    Bud Cline Tile Expert Charter Member Senior Member Published

    There ya go !!!:yesss:
    For future reference...If it isn't stated in the manufacturer's instructions: DON'T DO IT!
     
  10. Jim McClain

    Jim McClain TFP Owner/Founder Administrator

    No. It'll be a mess and the spread rate and consistency will be all off. Use a wide putty knife to scrape up the wet adhesive - do this as you go. Let everything dry, then shoot a couple pictures and let's see what should be next.

    Jim
     
  11. What is the square footage we're dealing with?
    I don't know where your going to put pieces as you remove, they all have to be separate. I believe warm soapy water to clean wet adhesive to remove remainder after scraping as you go?
     
  12. Dale S

    Dale S New Member

    I have about 100 sq ft. I'll pull them 1 at a time and try to clean as I go. I have a 2 car garage I can lay them down in. I guess my wife will have to leave her RollsRoyce out tonight.
     
  13. Jon Scanlan

    Jon Scanlan That Kiwi Charter Member I Support TFP Senior Member

    Fill up a large container, something which the planks will lay flat in, full of water and place the planks in it when you lift each one, take the tiles outside and then hose them off. Do not let the glue dry as it will take a lot longer as the water will then have react the glue.
    DO NOT use anything which has an oil base to remove the glue as the new glue will not stick to it
     
  14. Jim McClain

    Jim McClain TFP Owner/Founder Administrator

    I would think adding some dish soap to the (warm) water will help get the glue to release from the tiles/planks.
     
  15. Jon Scanlan

    Jon Scanlan That Kiwi Charter Member I Support TFP Senior Member

    Don't want warm water as it could change the shape of the tiles and it will get cold in a couple of minutes anyway. I wouldn't bother with soap either. Just lots of cold water :)
     
  16. Jim McClain

    Jim McClain TFP Owner/Founder Administrator

    Glue-party-pooper. :(
     


  17. Why does it sound like you have experience in this process Jon?
    I like that idea of efficiency, but the plank are cut to certain lengths.
     
  18. Jon Scanlan

    Jon Scanlan That Kiwi Charter Member I Support TFP Senior Member

    Never tried it but my way makes sense as once the glue dries it would be a lot harder to get off
    I have heard of other layers here lifting planks which were laid and then cleaning them off at a later date to relay on other jobs. He actually laid them to look like planking on a ships deck with the grout line but he put a 6 inch strip on the end of each plank which wasn't meant to be there. It was just meant to have the grout between the long lengths
    Re the cut planks. They would have to be juggled around to save waste when relaying. Maybe another box or so could be quicker than spending hours juggling?
     
  19. Dale S

    Dale S New Member

    well I read this a little late, this morning I removed all the tiles and cleaned with warm soapy water . Glue came off rather easily. Same for the vinyl floor. We used some mineral spirits on outside edges of some of the tiles where it was exposed to air and cured somewhat. It rolled off sort of like the rubber cement we used to use in school.
    Im leaving on a trip this week and will be gone about a month. I'm letting everything set till I get back. I'll going to be travel trailer trash for a while. Thanks for all the info and I'll be in contact befrore the attempted re-install. This is a great forum with very good advice.
    Thank You,
    Dale S
     
  20. Jon Scanlan

    Jon Scanlan That Kiwi Charter Member I Support TFP Senior Member

    That's why I wanted you to place the tiles into the water straight away to prevent the glue drying. The glue can dry to quickly when you don't want it to :)
     

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